First I wanted to ask you about the different producers you've worked with, starting with the early Blake Babies records and Gary Smith, through people like Paul Kolderie [Tape Op #22], Sean Slade [#22] and Scott Litt [#81].
Well, Gary Smith was the first real producer we worked with in the Blake Babies and we learned so much about recording from working with him, just because we were so green. He was really a stickler for separating sounds and getting really clean, pristine sounding recordings — it was the '80s — so with him we experienced the bizarre tactic of recording cymbals separately from the rest of the drum set, which was bizarre for Freda [Love Smith, the Blake Babies' drummer] and bizarre to see. It was like, when she would record the drums she'd be pretending to play a cymbal on her leg and then they would overdub all of the high hats and the rides and crashes and everything. So, the recordings that Gary produced were really well produced, and it was good for us because we learned how to polish things and how to do something other than just a live, raw band performance. We learned how to focus on perfecting performances and stuff like that.
The first Blake Babies record you did at the old Fort Apache in Roxbury?
No, I never went there. I'm talking about Earwig and Sunburn. We did them at the Cambridge Fort Apache, after the studio moved there from Roxbury.
What about Nicely, Nicely?
That one we did on our own. That was like demos we did at the Boston Film and Video Foundation. We knew someone who worked there and he was able to get us cheap or free time late at night. It was just us like going in and playing. I don't even remember, so I can't tell you much about those sessions. It was in the middle of the night- I think I was half asleep.
What about Rosy Jack World?
That was done in different places, if I remember correctly. We did some of that in Indiana with Paul Mahern. I know we did "Nirvana" in Indiana, but I don't remember where we did the other songs. Paul worked on the first Some Girls record too, [Feel It] — he and Jake Smith worked on that together.
What about Paul Kolderie and Sean Slade?
From Paul and Sean I learned about the beauty of big rock and roll guitars. They mixed guitars really loudly and they weren't afraid to record really loud amplifiers. I think Gary was more afraid to push the volume. Sean and Paul were all about rock and roll, whereas Gary would be trying to shape and tame and mold and polish a band. Sean and Paul were more like capturing what makes them them. They recorded Dinosaur [Jr]. Other engineers probably kicked Dinosaur out of the studio for being so incredibly loud, but not Paul and Sean.
There's some funny stuff that Matt Ashare wrote about talking to Paul and Sean about recording the early Dinosaur records.
And they're just good for coming up with quick, sensible arrangement ideas, like putting a keyboard here or doubling a guitar part there — really good instincts about arranging.
Did you play keyboard parts on the stuff you did with Sean and Paul?
Yeah, on Only Everything I played all of the keyboard parts, I think. I played piano, clavichord, organ, yeah.
What about some of the different studios you've worked in, from Fort Apache to Q Division to Bearsville to Cherokee, and all the other studios you've worked in? Are there certain things you remember liking or disliking about the different studios? What really struck you as a good studio environment or vibe?
The Fort Apache on Camp Street in Cambridge always had a really good vibe, which is something that you can't really explain. You walk in and it has such a great feeling. The main room where the drums are recorded is such a good, warm-sounding room. And the vibe in that studio is so nice and welcoming, whereas some other studios, just the fact that you're confronted by a person at a desk asking who you are — that's sort of off-putting. With Fort Apache you could always just walk in, and that was one of the great things about it. And that was the thing about Dreamland in Woodstock — a house in a church. It was like walking into a house, and there was no official studio person asking for your credentials as you walked in. I think a homey atmosphere is really important.
What about some of the places you've worked in L.A. or New York?
Every studio has it's own positive attributes. These are some of the places I've worked: The Magic Shop, Sear Sound, Cherokee, Ocean Way in L.A., Wally Gagel's house [Bliss Recordings] — it's on Gold Stars.
For example, you said every studio has its own particular good elements. Can you think of any of them?
Well with Sear Sound, everyone was always telling me what a great, cool place it was and what great equipment they had and what a cool guy Walter Sear was — and it's true, they had a lot of cool equipment, but I didn't like the vibe in there. You had to go up a sort of creepy elevator, and something about the feng shui was off-putting. I did some of Only Everything there and it didn't feel comfortable to me. I think it's something about recording in New York City — some of the studios feel sort of cramped, and just going up an elevator to go to a cramped studio inhibits my freedom in my head. But there's something to be said for cool equipment. I don't want to badmouth Sear Sound. Ocean Way was impressive — they had a huge room and Scott Litt had his own little room in the back of Ocean Way called Louie's Clubhouse, and I had a really good time there. It was small but cozy. We recorded Become What You Are at Hollywood Sound.
What was it like working with Scott Litt?
Scott Litt was great. I just loved him as a person. He was so laid back and what he did, really, was just basically record the band the way we'd been playing live for a year. And if you listen to Become What You Are, there's really not a whole lot of extra flourishes or overdubs. It's really just some doubled guitars and some background vocals that were added and a couple of keyboards. Scott just kind of tightened the performances up and had us rehearse in the studio a lot and made sure we were tight, and then he recorded us.
What about Cherokee? Didn't you work with the Robb Brothers?
We did two Lemonheads records there. They were so entertaining, the Robb Brothers. They're just like these old school L.A. guys and they have a lot of stories and there were always freaky, interesting people coming into the studio like Rick James, and Lita Ford came in with her little laptop dog, it was a really bizarre L.A. scene. It was just like being entertained all the time. I was just playing bass and singing background vocals.
What about working with Wally Gagel?
Working with him was really different for me because there was no drummer and no bass player. We were building songs from nothing. I would come up with a guitar riff or little chord progression and then he'd put them in his computer, and then I would go home and he'd build sections and put stuff together with drum loops and with bass parts. So that was an interesting experiment for me to give the song over to the producer. That was a new thing for me. We ended up with a couple cool songs, but they definitely sound like studio creations.
What songs?
"Don't Rush Me" and "Cool Rock Boy". Beautiful Creature was a bunch of demos that I did with different people and I was experimenting with different recording techniques, and those two songs ended up on the record.
I remember hearing his drum loops and programming on some of that stuff and being really impressed by it.
Yeah, it is really impressive, but I don't know how well that stuff is going to age. Just like the whole drum loop aesthetic in the '90s, you know, pop songs with drum loops underneath, I don't think it's aging very well. If you listen to a Neil Young record, like After the Gold Rush, it just sounds so much more bright and fresh. It just pops out of the speakers because of the human element. I really think that drum loops should die. I like what I did with Wally but it was an experiment and I don't really want to do it again.
Were there things you picked up from guesting on other people's records, like working with Aimee Mann? Do you remember anything about how she approaches recording or tracking vocals and harmonies?
Well by the time I got there, most of the stuff was already recorded and I was just doing some background vocals. They had ideas for what they wanted me to do and I just kind of did 'em the way they wanted me to. I don't think I really learned anything from that, other than how awesome Aimee's songs are — but I already knew that. The Susannah Hoffs stuff was done with David Kahne and he was like a big producer. He's worked with everyone from Romeo Void to Sugar Ray to the Bangles to Sublime. He's done all these huge hit records. I really liked him. He's an interesting guy. He knows a lot about a lot of things. The Blake Babies demoed a couple of songs with him one time — he was interested in signing us at one time. John [Strohm, guitar] and Freda were really — David's recording technique kind of rubbed them the wrong way. Everything needed to be really perfect and polished. John and Freda thought he was a bit of a taskmaster, but I gave myself over to the experience — sometimes you want to just let yourself be guided by the hand that has a lot of experience, even though it might feel unnatural. Because it feels unnatural, it might draw something out of you that you didn't know was in you. I think some people find it uncomfortable to be pushed that hard, 'cause some people are used to just going by their instincts. But at the time I really enjoyed being pushed really hard and being pushed to sing harder and to sing better. I've reverted back to a really quick, fast, simple way of singing and recording, only doing like three or four vocal takes — but it's good to know there's another way to approach it if you feel like doing a more perfect performance.
How do you approach recording vocals on a session? Does it differ from record to record?
